Running A Full Node - Bitcoin

Bitcoin - The Currency of the Internet

A community dedicated to Bitcoin, the currency of the Internet. Bitcoin is a distributed, worldwide, decentralized digital money. Bitcoins are issued and managed without any central authority whatsoever: there is no government, company, or bank in charge of Bitcoin. You might be interested in Bitcoin if you like cryptography, distributed peer-to-peer systems, or economics. A large percentage of Bitcoin enthusiasts are libertarians, though people of all political philosophies are welcome.

BAT Community Weekly Update: 02/16/2018 to 02/22/2018 — Bart Baker (10M subs) promotes Brave, interview with Brendan, big YouTube channels coming onboard, ETHDenver reflections, Ethereum wallet + hardware wallet support coming to Brave

Welcome to this week's community update! Now back from ETHDenver and seeing big adoption among major YouTube channels. Check it out! Thanks to MurphD for his invaluable contributions.
Short interview with Brendan Eich about BAT, Brave and JavaScript /w Panama Crypto
“The Basic Attention Token (BAT) forms the basis of a blockchain-based digital advertising platform. The BAT reconnects users directly to content creators, and reduces ad fraud and improves reporting for advertisers, without compromising user privacy and anonymity. The BAT platform cuts out all the parasitic middlemen in between brands, publishers and users, to make a much more efficient and accountable ecosystem.”
Read the full interview:
HowToBasic (10,300,000 subscribers) is now a verified YouTube Creator!
We’re seeing more and more channels come onboard, both large and small. HowToBasic has become famous with its… intriguing videos… now with 10.3 million subscribers!
Bart Baker (10 million subscribers) asks his audience to download Brave; video then locked by YouTube
This week, Bart Baker made a video calling out to his audience to support his channel with Brave’s referral program. However, shortly after uploading the video, it was removed by YouTube. Bart, understandably, was very upset with the situation and followed up on Twitter. You can follow the whole situation here:
  1. Tweet:
  2. Situation covered on /YouTube:
  3. Post on /BATProject with helpful links:
  4. Reuploaded video:
We wholeheartedly support Bart in his efforts to remonetize his videos and to continue creating the content that makes millions of people laugh around the world. Let’s show him some support. (Also check the #SaveBartBeBrave hashtag on Twitter.)
“The Best Ethereum Wallet Ever”: Ethereum Wallet coming to Brave with hardware wallet support
BAT/Brave’s hacking team at ETHDenver put their minds together and built an Ethereum wallet with hardware support for Brave. Features: 1-click wallet creation; 1-click shortcut to transfer funds from the ETH wallet into @Brave $BAT wallet; Hardware wallet support; Open source; Brave is up-to-date with the latest upstream Chromium release + sandboxing x-platforms; Automatically watches BAT token contract.
See a video demo and full description here:
The BAT/Brave team made an appearance at ETHDenver last week. It was a great experience and the team was excited to meet with countless fans and members of the community. Jennie, Luke and some cherished BAT community members (special shoutouts to miyayes, dragespir) answered hundreds of questions at the BAT/Brave booth.
The BAT/Brave booth was especially popular; publishers, advertisers as well as users were lining up to speak with the team and learn more. We had many people come and express their love for Brave, as well as newcomers of all kinds!
BAT/Brave also had two hacking teams at the event, (1) one of which created a fun retro game called Vapor ( while (2) the other implemented an Ethereum wallet into Brave (see above).
Luke participated in a panel on designing cryptoeconomic models, see the video here: link here
Check out this link to see all the videos from ETHDenver:
Zengineering Podcast: Episode 052 — with Jonathan Sampson, on Brave, Basic Attention Token and Browser Security
“In this episode, Jonathan walks us through the history of the internet and web browsers. We discuss Brave’s CEO, Brendan Eich, the prolific architect of the JavaScript programming language, and a founder and former CTO of the Mozilla Corporation. This story is compelling and important to the state of the modern web, modern software, and the entire planets intoxication with digital communication.
We dive deeply into web technologies, the digital advertising revolution, internet search, the history of web browsers, an intense appreciation of digital privacy, the future of technology, and digital crypto-currencies like Bitcoin and Basic Attention Token (a foundational component of what the Brave team is working on). We believe Brave Browser and its team are doing something that is both technologically innovative and deeply important for our digitized world.”
Listen now:

BAT/Brave Mentions:

Brave Browser Readers Just Gave Us Some Eth – is This Actually Working?
That’s our dashboard, so it’s not much and at current BAT prices … but it is something, and it is free.
The key to massive innovation in crypto
BAT is mentioned on a great article on Hacker Noon.
BAT and You; What I learned from the BAT team at ETHDenver
What’s Brave, YouTubers’ new favorite browser?
Brave is an open-source web browser that YouTubers are using in wake of the platform’s evolving policies. Included within the browser is Brave Payments, which the company introduced in beta in September 2016. The idea behind the Payments tool is that users should be allowed to choose who can financially benefit from their clicks without having to sift through ads — or feeling guilty about using ad blockers.

News You Should Know:

Google's new ad-blocking rules show its massive power online, and some smaller players are concerned
Google's dominance of the online ads business — in conjunction with the dominance of its Chrome browser and its influence on the group that selected which ads count as "intrusive" — raises some thorny questions.
Chrome's default ad blocker strengthens Google's data-driven advertising platforms
Google's browser now blocks certain ad formats by default. This move is less about improving the browsing experience and more about forcing publishers and advertisers to switch to Google’s data-driven advertising platforms.
Something to think about

Brave Team Tweets:

  • Twitch coming in the next few weeks CryptoBlockchainBTCETH @CrytpoBlock Does your team have an estimate for when Twitch will be fully integrated with BAT and Brave? //REPLY [email protected] Weeks not months, my best thought. 9:19 PM - Feb 17, 2018
  • BrendanEich‏ @BrendanEich Content owners are paid in the fiats they use by @upholdinc for regions in which Uphold operates. Conversion from BAT is part of their service. 10:58 PM - 17 Feb 2018 Direct photo link: Second photo link 2:
  • BAT / Brave is a piece to cake compared to how ads work now BrendanEich @BrendanEich Compared to ad tech (the “Lumascape”), it is a piece of cake. Note users need not study it to find Brave easy to use. 6:12 PM - Feb 18, 2018
  • There’s always a middleman in the ad space: BrendanEich @BrendanEich At least one middle-person in any advertisepublisher relation: the user. Brave is the user agent, we take fixed fee always less than user share (70% revenue to user for private opt-in ads; 15% to user & 70 to pub if both consent to in-page ads), & no user data goes off device. 6:20 PM - Feb 18, 2018
  • What’s the point of BAT, and do users of the web have rights? BrendanEich @BrendanEich The point is to send revenue back to your favored sites & creators anonymously — Web is not going to fund itself. Replace the ad tech complex with private/anon analytics, self- or (bigger idea) auto-funded.
  • BrendanEich @BrendanEich Users have rights to block ads/trackers/scripts, but many see ecosystem problem of free-riding that way. Some can afford to pay & Brave enables anonymous contributuons, automated and/or pinned by user. Not all can afford, so private BAT ad option is coming, to pay for contribs. 6:53 PM - Feb 18, 2018
  • Future features preview: BrendanEich @BrendanEichWe do WebTorrent IPFS & dat: coming soon. We are not only for browsing one new & incompatible web. Web is here and evolves. 8:02 PM - Feb 20, 2018

Roaring Fans on Twitter:

  • Nick Summers @nicksum18 ..And the home of the @Brave !! For those of you who have not yet tried the new Brave browser, this is one days worth of benefits;$BAT #BEBRAVE #[email protected] @BraveSampson 9:15 PM - Feb 16, 2018
  • Shilly Mo'Filly @EzMrcz Awesome, just got notified from @brave that $BAT payments are going out to my favorite content contributors soon! Thanks again for creating awesome stuff, enjoy the @AttentionToken :D Can't wait until more and more people adopt the idea of giving directly to the creators! 1:35 PM - Feb 16, 2018
  • Janus @Janus_Token Some of the inspiration for incorporating $Kreds cryptocurrency in our media sites came from economic models like $BAT true utility can be game changing. Kudos to @AttentionToken for inspiring valid altcoin use cases. 12:26 AM - Feb 17, 2018
  • Kevin [LTC] [BAT] @wholelotamoney $BAT in Denver being a proud sponsor of #ETHDenver @EthereumDenver Fantastic browser and great [email protected] @brave @BrendanEich 9:48 AM - Feb 17, 2018
  • Miyayes @miyayesereum Re. Botting: 1. Fraud/bot detection running in native app (browser) will always be better than through in-page JS; 2. KYC for payouts; 3. Can't summon ads en masse by nav to a site; low freq ads only show at specific times during browsing xp. Erase old ad model from your mind. 7:40 PM - Feb 19, 2018
  • Fabrice Desré @fabricedesre I just paid publishers with @AttentionToken from @brave . That was much easier than any other subscription mechanism. 5:50 PM - Feb 20, 2018
submitted by CryptoJennie to BATProject [link] [comments]

Is anyone else freaked out by this whole blocksize debate? Does anyone else find themself often agreeing with *both* sides - depending on whichever argument you happen to be reading at the moment? And do we need some better algorithms and data structures?

Why do both sides of the debate seem “right” to me?
I know, I know, a healthy debate is healthy and all - and maybe I'm just not used to the tumult and jostling which would be inevitable in a real live open major debate about something as vital as Bitcoin.
And I really do agree with the starry-eyed idealists who say Bitcoin is vital. Imperfect as it may be, it certainly does seem to represent the first real chance we've had in the past few hundred years to try to steer our civilization and our planet away from the dead-ends and disasters which our government-issued debt-based currencies keep dragging us into.
But this particular debate, about the blocksize, doesn't seem to be getting resolved at all.
Pretty much every time I read one of the long-form major arguments contributed by Bitcoin "thinkers" who I've come to respect over the past few years, this weird thing happens: I usually end up finding myself nodding my head and agreeing with whatever particular piece I'm reading!
But that should be impossible - because a lot of these people vehemently disagree!
So how can both sides sound so convincing to me, simply depending on whichever piece I currently happen to be reading?
Does anyone else feel this way? Or am I just a gullible idiot?
Just Do It?
When you first look at it or hear about it, increasing the size seems almost like a no-brainer: The "big-block" supporters say just increase the blocksize to 20 MB or 8 MB, or do some kind of scheduled or calculated regular increment which tries to take into account the capabilities of the infrastructure and the needs of the users. We do have the bandwidth and the memory to at least increase the blocksize now, they say - and we're probably gonna continue to have more bandwidth and memory in order to be able to keep increasing the blocksize for another couple decades - pretty much like everything else computer-based we've seen over the years (some of this stuff is called by names such as "Moore's Law").
On the other hand, whenever the "small-block" supporters warn about the utter catastrophe that a failed hard-fork would mean, I get totally freaked by their possible doomsday scenarios, which seem totally plausible and terrifying - so I end up feeling that the only way I'd want to go with a hard-fork would be if there was some pre-agreed "triggering" mechanism where the fork itself would only actually "switch on" and take effect provided that some "supermajority" of the network (of who? the miners? the full nodes?) had signaled (presumably via some kind of totally reliable p2p trustless software-based voting system?) that they do indeed "pre-agree" to actually adopt the pre-scheduled fork (and thereby avoid any possibility whatsoever of the precious blockchain somehow tragically splitting into two and pretty much killing this cryptocurrency off in its infancy).
So in this "conservative" scenario, I'm talking about wanting at least 95% pre-adoption agreement - not the mere 75% which I recall some proposals call for, which seems like it could easily lead to a 75/25 blockchain split.
But this time, with this long drawn-out blocksize debate, the core devs, and several other important voices who have become prominent opinion shapers over the past few years, can't seem to come to any real agreement on this.
Weird split among the devs
As far as I can see, there's this weird split: Gavin and Mike seem to be the only people among the devs who really want a major blocksize increase - and all the other devs seem to be vehemently against them.
But then on the other hand, the users seem to be overwhelmingly in favor of a major increase.
And there are meta-questions about governance, about about why this didn't come out as a BIP, and what the availability of Bitcoin XT means.
And today or yesterday there was this really cool big-blockian exponential graph based on doubling the blocksize every two years for twenty years, reminding us of the pure mathematical fact that 210 is indeed about 1000 - but not really addressing any of the game-theoretic points raised by the small-blockians. So a lot of the users seem to like it, but when so few devs say anything positive about it, I worry: is this just yet more exponential chart porn?
On the one hand, Gavin's and Mike's blocksize increase proposal initially seemed like a no-brainer to me.
And on the other hand, all the other devs seem to be against them. Which is weird - not what I'd initially expected at all (but maybe I'm just a fool who's seduced by exponential chart porn?).
Look, I don't mean to be rude to any of the core devs, and I don't want to come off like someone wearing a tinfoil hat - but it has to cross people's minds that the powers that be (the Fed and the other central banks and the governments that use their debt-issued money to run this world into a ditch) could very well be much more scared shitless than they're letting on. If we assume that the powers that be are using their usual playbook and tactics, then it could be worth looking at the book "Confessions of an Economic Hitman" by John Perkins, to get an idea of how they might try to attack Bitcoin. So, what I'm saying is, they do have a track record of sending in "experts" to try to derail projects and keep everyone enslaved to the Creature from Jekyll Island. I'm just saying. So, without getting ad hominem - let's just make sure that our ideas can really stand scrutiny on their own - as Nick Szabo says, we need to make sure there is "more computer science, less noise" in this debate.
When Gavin Andresen first came out with the 20 MB thing - I sat back and tried to imagine if I could download 20 MB in 10 minutes (which seems to be one of the basic mathematical and technological constraints here - right?)
I figured, "Yeah, I could download that" - even with my crappy internet connection.
And I guess the telecoms might be nice enough to continue to double our bandwidth every two years for the next couple decades – if we ask them politely?
On the other hand - I think we should be careful about entrusting the financial freedom of the world into the greedy hands of the telecoms companies - given all their shady shenanigans over the past few years in many countries. After decades of the MPAA and the FBI trying to chip away at BitTorrent, lately PirateBay has been hard to access. I would say it's quite likely that certain persons at institutions like JPMorgan and Goldman Sachs and the Fed might be very, very motivated to see Bitcoin fail - so we shouldn't be too sure about scaling plans which depend on the willingness of companies Verizon and AT&T to double our bandwith every two years.
Maybe the real important hardware buildout challenge for a company like 21 (and its allies such as Qualcomm) to take on now would not be "a miner in every toaster" but rather "Google Fiber Download and Upload Speeds in every Country, including China".
I think I've read all the major stuff on the blocksize debate from Gavin Andresen, Mike Hearn, Greg Maxwell, Peter Todd, Adam Back, and Jeff Garzick and several other major contributors - and, oddly enough, all their arguments seem reasonable - heck even Luke-Jr seems reasonable to me on the blocksize debate, and I always thought he was a whackjob overly influenced by superstition and numerology - and now today I'm reading the article by Bram Cohen - the inventor of BitTorrent - and I find myself agreeing with him too!
I say to myself: What's going on with me? How can I possibly agree with all of these guys, if they all have such vehemently opposing viewpoints?
I mean, think back to the glory days of a couple of years ago, when all we were hearing was how this amazing unprecedented grassroots innovation called Bitcoin was going to benefit everyone from all walks of life, all around the world:
...basically the entire human race transacting everything into the blockchain.
(Although let me say that I think that people's focus on ideas like driverless cabs creating realtime fare markets based on supply and demand seems to be setting our sights a bit low as far as Bitcoin's abilities to correct the financial world's capital-misallocation problems which seem to have been made possible by infinite debt-based fiat. I would have hoped that a Bitcoin-based economy would solve much more noble, much more urgent capital-allocation problems than driverless taxicabs creating fare markets or refrigerators ordering milk on the internet of things. I was thinking more along the lines that Bitcoin would finally strangle dead-end debt-based deadly-toxic energy industries like fossil fuels and let profitable clean energy industries like Thorium LFTRs take over - but that's another topic. :=)
Paradoxes in the blocksize debate
Let me summarize the major paradoxes I see here:
(1) Regarding the people (the majority of the core devs) who are against a blocksize increase: Well, the small-blocks arguments do seem kinda weird, and certainly not very "populist", in the sense that: When on earth have end-users ever heard of a computer technology whose capacity didn't grow pretty much exponentially year-on-year? All the cool new technology we've had - from hard drives to RAM to bandwidth - started out pathetically tiny and grew to unimaginably huge over the past few decades - and all our software has in turn gotten massively powerful and big and complex (sometimes bloated) to take advantage of the enormous new capacity available.
But now suddenly, for the first time in the history of technology, we seem to have a majority of the devs, on a major p2p project - saying: "Let's not scale the system up. It could be dangerous. It might break the whole system (if the hard-fork fails)."
I don't know, maybe I'm missing something here, maybe someone else could enlighten me, but I don't think I've ever seen this sort of thing happen in the last few decades of the history of technology - devs arguing against scaling up p2p technology to take advantage of expected growth in infrastructure capacity.
(2) But... on the other hand... the dire warnings of the small-blockians about what could happen if a hard-fork were to fail - wow, they do seem really dire! And these guys are pretty much all heavyweight, experienced programmers and/or game theorists and/or p2p open-source project managers.
I must say, that nearly all of the long-form arguments I've read - as well as many, many of the shorter comments I've read from many users in the threads, whose names I at least have come to more-or-less recognize over the past few months and years on reddit and bitcointalk - have been amazingly impressive in their ability to analyze all aspects of the lifecycle and management of open-source software projects, bringing up lots of serious points which I could never have come up with, and which seem to come from long experience with programming and project management - as well as dealing with economics and human nature (eg, greed - the game-theory stuff).
So a lot of really smart and experienced people with major expertise in various areas ranging from programming to management to game theory to politics to economics have been making some serious, mature, compelling arguments.
But, as I've been saying, the only problem to me is: in many of these cases, these arguments are vehemently in opposition to each other! So I find myself agreeing with pretty much all of them, one by one - which means the end result is just a giant contradiction.
I mean, today we have Bram Cohen, the inventor of BitTorrent, arguing (quite cogently and convincingly to me), that it would be dangerous to increase the blocksize. And this seems to be a guy who would know a few things about scaling out a massive global p2p network - since the protocol which he invented, BitTorrent, is now apparently responsible for like a third of the traffic on the internet (and this despite the long-term concerted efforts of major evil players such as the MPAA and the FBI to shut the whole thing down).
Was the BitTorrent analogy too "glib"?
By the way - I would like to go on a slight tangent here and say that one of the main reasons why I felt so "comfortable" jumping on the Bitcoin train back a few years ago, when I first heard about it and got into it, was the whole rough analogy I saw with BitTorrent.
I remembered the perhaps paradoxical fact that when a torrent is more popular (eg, a major movie release that just came out last week), then it actually becomes faster to download. More people want it, so more people have a few pieces of it, so more people are able to get it from each other. A kind of self-correcting economic feedback loop, where more demand directly leads to more supply.
(BitTorrent manages to pull this off by essentially adding a certain structure to the file being shared, so that it's not simply like an append-only list of 1 MB blocks, but rather more like an random-access or indexed array of 1 MB chunks. Say you're downloading a film which is 700 MB. As soon as your "client" program has downloaded a single 1-MB chunk - say chunk #99 - your "client" program instantly turns into a "server" program as well - offering that chunk #99 to other clients. From my simplistic understanding, I believe the Bitcoin protocol does something similar, to provide a p2p architecture. Hence my - perhaps naïve - assumption that Bitcoin already had the right algorithms / architecture / data structure to scale.)
The efficiency of the BitTorrent network seemed to jive with that "network law" (Metcalfe's Law?) about fax machines. This law states that the more fax machines there are, the more valuable the network of fax machines becomes. Or the value of the network grows on the order of the square of the number of nodes.
This is in contrast with other technology like cars, where the more you have, the worse things get. The more cars there are, the more traffic jams you have, so things start going downhill. I guess this is because highway space is limited - after all, we can't pave over the entire countryside, and we never did get those flying cars we were promised, as David Graeber laments in a recent essay in The Baffler magazine :-)
And regarding the "stress test" supposedly happening right now in the middle of this ongoing blocksize debate, I don't know what worries me more: the fact that it apparently is taking only $5,000 to do a simple kind of DoS on the blockchain - or the fact that there are a few rumors swirling around saying that the unknown company doing the stress test shares the same physical mailing address with a "scam" company?
Or maybe we should just be worried that so much of this debate is happening on a handful of forums which are controlled by some guy named theymos who's already engaged in some pretty "contentious" or "controversial" behavior like blowing a million dollars on writing forum software (I guess he never heard that software is open-source)?
So I worry that the great promise of "decentralization" might be more fragile than we originally thought.
Anyways, back to Metcalfe's Law: with virtual stuff, like torrents and fax machines, the more the merrier. The more people downloading a given movie, the faster it arrives - and the more people own fax machines, the more valuable the overall fax network.
So I kindof (naïvely?) assumed that Bitcoin, being "virtual" and p2p, would somehow scale up the same magical way BitTorrrent did. I just figured that more people using it would somehow automatically make it stronger and faster.
But now a lot of devs have started talking in terms of the old "scarcity" paradigm, talking about blockspace being a "scarce resource" and talking about "fee markets" - which seems kinda scary, and antithetical to much of the earlier rhetoric we heard about Bitcoin (the stuff about supporting our favorite creators with micropayments, and the stuff about Africans using SMS to send around payments).
Look, when some asshole is in line in front of you at the cash register and he's holding up the line so they can run his credit card to buy a bag of Cheeto's, we tend to get pissed off at the guy - clogging up our expensive global electronic payment infrastructure to make a two-dollar purchase. And that's on a fairly efficient centralized system - and presumably after a year or so, VISA and the guy's bank can delete or compress the transaction in their SQL databases.
Now, correct me if I'm wrong, but if some guy buys a coffee on the blockchain, or if somebody pays an online artist $1.99 for their work - then that transaction, a few bytes or so, has to live on the blockchain forever?
Or is there some "pruning" thing that gets rid of it after a while?
And this could lead to another question: Viewed from the perspective of double-entry bookkeeping, is the blockchain "world-wide ledger" more like the "balance sheet" part of accounting, i.e. a snapshot showing current assets and liabilities? Or is it more like the "cash flow" part of accounting, i.e. a journal showing historical revenues and expenses?
When I think of thousands of machines around the globe having to lug around multiple identical copies of a multi-gigabyte file containing some asshole's coffee purchase forever and ever... I feel like I'm ideologically drifting in one direction (where I'd end up also being against really cool stuff like online micropayments and Africans banking via SMS)... so I don't want to go there.
But on the other hand, when really experienced and battle-tested veterans with major experience in the world of open-souce programming and project management (the "small-blockians") warn of the catastrophic consequences of a possible failed hard-fork, I get freaked out and I wonder if Bitcoin really was destined to be a settlement layer for big transactions.
Could the original programmer(s) possibly weigh in?
And I don't mean to appeal to authority - but heck, where the hell is Satoshi Nakamoto in all this? I do understand that he/she/they would want to maintain absolute anonymity - but on the other hand, I assume SN wants Bitcoin to succeed (both for the future of humanity - or at least for all the bitcoins SN allegedly holds :-) - and I understand there is a way that SN can cryptographically sign a message - and I understand that as the original developer of Bitcoin, SN had some very specific opinions about the blocksize... So I'm kinda wondering of Satoshi could weigh in from time to time. Just to help out a bit. I'm not saying "Show us a sign" like a deity or something - but damn it sure would be fascinating and possibly very helpful if Satoshi gave us his/hetheir 2 satoshis worth at this really confusing juncture.
Are we using our capacity wisely?
I'm not a programming or game-theory whiz, I'm just a casual user who has tried to keep up with technology over the years.
It just seems weird to me that here we have this massive supercomputer (500 times more powerful than the all the supercomputers in the world combined) doing fairly straightforward "embarassingly parallel" number-crunching operations to secure a p2p world-wide ledger called the blockchain to keep track of a measly 2.1 quadrillion tokens spread out among a few billion addresses - and a couple of years ago you had people like Rick Falkvinge saying the blockchain would someday be supporting multi-million-dollar letters of credit for international trade and you had people like Andreas Antonopoulos saying the blockchain would someday allow billions of "unbanked" people to send remittances around the village or around the world dirt-cheap - and now suddenly in June 2015 we're talking about blockspace as a "scarce resource" and talking about "fee markets" and partially centralized, corporate-sponsored "Level 2" vaporware like Lightning Network and some mysterious company is "stess testing" or "DoS-ing" the system by throwing away a measly $5,000 and suddenly it sounds like the whole system could eventually head right back into PayPal and Western Union territory again, in terms of expensive fees.
When I got into Bitcoin, I really was heavily influenced by vague analogies with BitTorrent: I figured everyone would just have tiny little like utorrent-type program running on their machine (ie, Bitcoin-QT or Armory or Mycelium etc.).
I figured that just like anyone can host a their own blog or webserver, anyone would be able to host their own bank.
Yeah, Google and and Mozilla and Twitter and Facebook and WhatsApp did come along and build stuff on top of TCP/IP, so I did expect a bunch of companies to build layers on top of the Bitcoin protocol as well. But I still figured the basic unit of bitcoin client software powering the overall system would be small and personal and affordable and p2p - like a bittorrent client - or at the most, like a cheap server hosting a blog or email server.
And I figured there would be a way at the software level, at the architecture level, at the algorithmic level, at the data structure level - to let the thing scale - if not infinitely, at least fairly massively and gracefully - the same way the BitTorrent network has.
Of course, I do also understand that with BitTorrent, you're sharing a read-only object (eg, a movie) - whereas with Bitcoin, you're achieving distributed trustless consensus and appending it to a write-only (or append-only) database.
So I do understand that the problem which BitTorrent solves is much simpler than the problem which Bitcoin sets out to solve.
But still, it seems that there's got to be a way to make this thing scale. It's p2p and it's got 500 times more computing power than all the supercomputers in the world combined - and so many brilliant and motivated and inspired people want this thing to succeed! And Bitcoin could be our civilization's last chance to steer away from the oncoming debt-based ditch of disaster we seem to be driving into!
It just seems that Bitcoin has got to be able to scale somehow - and all these smart people working together should be able to come up with a solution which pretty much everyone can agree - in advance - will work.
Right? Right?
A (probably irrelevant) tangent on algorithms and architecture and data structures
I'll finally weigh with my personal perspective - although I might be biased due to my background (which is more on the theoretical side of computer science).
My own modest - or perhaps radical - suggestion would be to ask whether we're really looking at all the best possible algorithms and architectures and data structures out there.
From this perspective, I sometimes worry that the overwhelming majority of the great minds working on the programming and game-theory stuff might come from a rather specific, shall we say "von Neumann" or "procedural" or "imperative" school of programming (ie, C and Python and Java programmers).
It seems strange to me that such a cutting-edge and important computer project would have so little participation from the great minds at the other end of the spectrum of programming paradigms - namely, the "functional" and "declarative" and "algebraic" (and co-algebraic!) worlds.
For example, I was struck in particular by statements I've seen here and there (which seemed rather hubristic or lackadaisical to me - for something as important as Bitcoin), that the specification of Bitcoin and the blockchain doesn't really exist in any form other than the reference implementation(s) (in procedural languages such as C or Python?).
Curry-Howard anyone?
I mean, many computer scientists are aware of the Curry-Howard isomorophism, which basically says that the relationship between a theorem and its proof is equivalent to the relationship between a specification and its implementation. In other words, there is a long tradition in mathematics (and in computer programming) of:
And it's not exactly "turtles all the way down" either: a specification is generally simple and compact enough that a good programmer can usually simply visually inspect it to determine if it is indeed "correct" - something which is very difficult, if not impossible, to do with a program written in a procedural, implementation-oriented language such as C or Python or Java.
So I worry that we've got this tradition, from the open-source github C/Java programming tradition, of never actually writing our "specification", and only writing the "implementation". In mission-critical military-grade programming projects (which often use languages like Ada or Maude) this is simply not allowed. It would seem that a project as mission-critical as Bitcoin - which could literally be crucial for humanity's continued survival - should also use this kind of military-grade software development approach.
And I'm not saying rewrite the implementations in these kind of theoretical languages. But it might be helpful if the C/Python/Java programmers in the Bitcoin imperative programming world could build some bridges to the Maude/Haskell/ML programmers of the functional and algebraic programming worlds to see if any kind of useful cross-pollination might take place - between specifications and implementations.
For example, the JavaFAN formal analyzer for multi-threaded Java programs (developed using tools based on the Maude language) was applied to the Remote Agent AI program aboard NASA's Deep Space 1 shuttle, written in Java - and it took only a few minutes using formal mathematical reasoning to detect a potential deadlock which would have occurred years later during the space mission when the damn spacecraft was already way out around Pluto.
And "the Maude-NRL (Naval Research Laboratory) Protocol Analyzer (Maude-NPA) is a tool used to provide security proofs of cryptographic protocols and to search for protocol flaws and cryptosystem attacks."
These are open-source formal reasoning tools developed by DARPA and used by NASA and the US Navy to ensure that program implementations satisfy their specifications. It would be great if some of the people involved in these kinds of projects could contribute to help ensure the security and scalability of Bitcoin.
But there is a wide abyss between the kinds of programmers who use languages like Maude and the kinds of programmers who use languages like C/Python/Java - and it can be really hard to get the two worlds to meet. There is a bit of rapprochement between these language communities in languages which might be considered as being somewhere in the middle, such as Haskell and ML. I just worry that Bitcoin might be turning into being an exclusively C/Python/Java project (with the algorithms and practitioners traditionally of that community), when it could be more advantageous if it also had some people from the functional and algebraic-specification and program-verification community involved as well. The thing is, though: the theoretical practitioners are big on "semantics" - I've heard them say stuff like "Yes but a C / C++ program has no easily identifiable semantics". So to get them involved, you really have to first be able to talk about what your program does (specification) - before proceeding to describe how it does it (implementation). And writing high-level specifications is typically very hard using the syntax and semantics of languages like C and Java and Python - whereas specs are fairly easy to write in Maude - and not only that, they're executable, and you state and verify properties about them - which provides for the kind of debate Nick Szabo was advocating ("more computer science, less noise").
Imagine if we had an executable algebraic specification of Bitcoin in Maude, where we could formally reason about and verify certain crucial game-theoretical properties - rather than merely hand-waving and arguing and deploying and praying.
And so in the theoretical programming community you've got major research on various logics such as Girard's Linear Logic (which is resource-conscious) and Bruni and Montanari's Tile Logic (which enables "pasting" bigger systems together from smaller ones in space and time), and executable algebraic specification languages such as Meseguer's Maude (which would be perfect for game theory modeling, with its functional modules for specifying the deterministic parts of systems and its system modules for specifiying non-deterministic parts of systems, and its parameterized skeletons for sketching out the typical architectures of mobile systems, and its formal reasoning and verification tools and libraries which have been specifically applied to testing and breaking - and fixing - cryptographic protocols).
And somewhat closer to the practical hands-on world, you've got stuff like Google's MapReduce and lots of Big Data database languages developed by Google as well. And yet here we are with a mempool growing dangerously big for RAM on a single machine, and a 20-GB append-only list as our database - and not much debate on practical results from Google's Big Data databases.
(And by the way: maybe I'm totally ignorant for asking this, but I'll ask anyways: why the hell does the mempool have to stay in RAM? Couldn't it work just as well if it were stored temporarily on the hard drive?)
And you've got CalvinDB out of Yale which apparently provides an ACID layer on top of a massively distributed database.
Look, I'm just an armchair follower cheering on these projects. I can barely manage to write a query in SQL, or read through a C or Python or Java program. But I would argue two points here: (1) these languages may be too low-level and "non-formal" for writing and modeling and formally reasoning about and proving properties of mission-critical specifications - and (2) there seem to be some Big Data tools already deployed by institutions such as Google and Yale which support global petabyte-size databases on commodity boxes with nice properties such as near-real-time and ACID - and I sometimes worry that the "core devs" might be failing to review the literature (and reach out to fellow programmers) out there to see if there might be some formal program-verification and practical Big Data tools out there which could be applied to coming up with rock-solid, 100% consensus proposals to handle an issue such as blocksize scaling, which seems to have become much more intractable than many people might have expected.
I mean, the protocol solved the hard stuff: the elliptical-curve stuff and the Byzantine General stuff. How the heck can we be falling down on the comparatively "easier" stuff - like scaling the blocksize?
It just seems like defeatism to say "Well, the blockchain is already 20-30 GB and it's gonna be 20-30 TB ten years from now - and we need 10 Mbs bandwidth now and 10,000 Mbs bandwidth 20 years from - assuming the evil Verizon and AT&T actually give us that - so let's just become a settlement platform and give up on buying coffee or banking the unbanked or doing micropayments, and let's push all that stuff into some corporate-controlled vaporware without even a whitepaper yet."
So you've got Peter Todd doing some possibly brilliant theorizing and extrapolating on the idea of "treechains" - there is a Let's Talk Bitcoin podcast from about a year ago where he sketches the rough outlines of this idea out in a very inspiring, high-level way - although the specifics have yet to be hammered out. And we've got Blockstream also doing some hopeful hand-waving about the Lightning Network.
Things like Peter Todd's treechains - which may be similar to the spark in some devs' eyes called Lightning Network - are examples of the kind of algorithm or architecture which might manage to harness the massive computing power of miners and nodes in such a way that certain kinds of massive and graceful scaling become possible.
It just seems like a kindof tiny dev community working on this stuff.
Being a C or Python or Java programmer should not be a pre-req to being able to help contribute to the specification (and formal reasoning and program verification) for Bitcoin and the blockchain.
XML and UML are crap modeling and specification languages, and C and Java and Python are even worse (as specification languages - although as implementation languages, they are of course fine).
But there are serious modeling and specification languages out there, and they could be very helpful at times like this - where what we're dealing with is questions of modeling and specification (ie, "needs and requirements").
One just doesn't often see the practical, hands-on world of open-source github implementation-level programmers and the academic, theoretical world of specification-level programmers meeting very often. I wish there were some way to get these two worlds to collaborate on Bitcoin.
Maybe a good first step to reach out to the theoretical people would be to provide a modular executable algebraic specification of the Bitcoin protocol in a recognized, military/NASA-grade specification language such as Maude - because that's something the theoretical community can actually wrap their heads around, whereas it's very hard to get them to pay attention to something written only as a C / Python / Java implementation (without an accompanying specification in a formal language).
They can't check whether the program does what it's supposed to do - if you don't provide a formal mathematical definition of what the program is supposed to do.
Specification : Implementation :: Theorem : Proof
You have to remember: the theoretical community is very aware of the Curry-Howard isomorphism. Just like it would be hard to get a mathematician's attention by merely showing them a proof without telling also telling them what theorem the proof is proving - by the same token, it's hard to get the attention of a theoretical computer scientist by merely showing them an implementation without showing them the specification that it implements.
Bitcoin is currently confronted with a mathematical or "computer science" problem: how to secure the network while getting high enough transactional throughput, while staying within the limited RAM, bandwidth and hard drive space limitations of current and future infrastructure.
The problem only becomes a political and economic problem if we give up on trying to solve it as a mathematical and "theoretical computer science" problem.
There should be a plethora of whitepapers out now proposing algorithmic solutions to these scaling issues. Remember, all we have to do is apply the Byzantine General consensus-reaching procedure to a worldwide database which shuffles 2.1 quadrillion tokens among a few billion addresses. The 21 company has emphatically pointed out that racing to compute a hash to add a block is an "embarrassingly parallel" problem - very easy to decompose among cheap, fault-prone, commodity boxes, and recompose into an overall solution - along the lines of Google's highly successful MapReduce.
I guess what I'm really saying is (and I don't mean to be rude here), is that C and Python and Java programmers might not be the best qualified people to develop and formally prove the correctness of (note I do not say: "test", I say "formally prove the correctness of") these kinds of algorithms.
I really believe in the importance of getting the algorithms and architectures right - look at Google Search itself, it uses some pretty brilliant algorithms and architectures (eg, MapReduce, Paxos) which enable it to achieve amazing performance - on pretty crappy commodity hardware. And look at BitTorrent, which is truly p2p, where more demand leads to more supply.
So, in this vein, I will close this lengthy rant with an oddly specific link - which may or may not be able to make some interesting contributions to finding suitable algorithms, architectures and data structures which might help Bitcoin scale massively. I have no idea if this link could be helpful - but given the near-total lack of people from the Haskell and ML and functional worlds in these Bitcoin specification debates, I thought I'd be remiss if I didn't throw this out - just in case there might be something here which could help us channel the massive computing power of the Bitcoin network in such a way as to enable us simply sidestep this kind of desperate debate where both sides seem right because the other side seems wrong.
The above paper is about "higher dimensional trees". It uses a bit of category theory (not a whole lot) and a bit of Haskell (again not a lot - just a simple data structure called a Rose tree, which has a wikipedia page) to develop a very expressive and efficient data structure which generalizes from lists to trees to higher dimensions.
I have no idea if this kind of data structure could be applicable to the current scaling mess we apparently are getting bogged down in - I don't have the game-theory skills to figure it out.
I just thought that since the blockchain is like a list, and since there are some tree-like structures which have been grafted on for efficiency (eg Merkle trees) and since many of the futuristic scaling proposals seem to also involve generalizing from list-like structures (eg, the blockchain) to tree-like structures (eg, side-chains and tree-chains)... well, who knows, there might be some nugget of algorithmic or architectural or data-structure inspiration there.
So... TL;DR:
(1) I'm freaked out that this blocksize debate has splintered the community so badly and dragged on so long, with no resolution in sight, and both sides seeming so right (because the other side seems so wrong).
(2) I think Bitcoin could gain immensely by using high-level formal, algebraic and co-algebraic program specification and verification languages (such as Maude including Maude-NPA, Mobile Maude parameterized skeletons, etc.) to specify (and possibly also, to some degree, verify) what Bitcoin does - before translating to low-level implementation languages such as C and Python and Java saying how Bitcoin does it. This would help to communicate and reason about programs with much more mathematical certitude - and possibly obviate the need for many political and economic tradeoffs which currently seem dismally inevitable - and possibly widen the collaboration on this project.
(3) I wonder if there are some Big Data approaches out there (eg, along the lines of Google's MapReduce and BigTable, or Yale's CalvinDB), which could be implemented to allow Bitcoin to scale massively and painlessly - and to satisfy all stakeholders, ranging from millionaires to micropayments, coffee drinkers to the great "unbanked".
submitted by BeYourOwnBank to Bitcoin [link] [comments]

AMA Brandan Eich - Creator of Javascript, Mozilla Firefox & Brave Software in Ark slack

boldninja @brendaneich hi Brendan welcome to Ark slack - Brendan is the creator of JavaScript, co-founder of Mozilla / Firefox & Brave Software and today we'll host AMA with him regarding his upcoming project BasicAttentionToken
moobox i think i'm gonna forget about bitbay and keep it
dr10 hi brendan
brendaneich hi
dr10 nice to have you here :smile:
boldninja hi Brendan - thanks for joining us today
brendaneich happy to be here @boldninja
tranzer hi @brendaneich , I have a question regarding BAT. Will you have limited number of tokens or will you have inflation? When do you plan to start ICO? (edited)
michaelthecryptoguy Hello Brendan. Nice to have you in the ark community slack channel
mward Hello
moobox the ironies of old age. you can afford the sports car you dreamed of as a kid, but your back hurts too much to sit in it.
dr10 Will Mozilla- and Chrome-Plugins be usuable for Brave browser? Will Brave Browser be able to sync bookmarks?
mike hi brendan
cannabanana is the BAT token just an ETH asset or will it be a new blockchain technology? if the first, why ETH instead of your own block chain? :smile: (edited)
brendaneich @dr10 two questions, first one first
jonathansampson @dr10 Chrome extensions are supported today, I wrote a short walkthrough on how we (I'm an engineer on Brave) test extensions before adopting for official support. Happy to answer any questions you may have. (edited)
brendaneich 1. Brave on laptop/desktop uses chromium and we support chromium extensions, but curate them into our own S3 from the Chrome Web Store ah, there is @jonathansampson on to second q
jakethepanda @brendaneich How will Brave detect bots designed to give fake attention? (edited)
brendaneich 2. Brave's client-encrypted sync is in beta now, if you use iOS i can connect you with the devs to get a beta build. it works between laptop/desktop systems already, and is coming up in Android too @cannabanana BAT is an ERC20 token on Ethereum. we need smart contracts and benefit from multiple token launches proving the tech and approach no desire to do our own blockchain
mward The BAT wallet will be implemented in Brave browser as a plug-in?
brendaneich we are pragmatists, use bitcoin already in Brave for auto-microdonations
cannabanana will you only accept ethereum for the ICO or will you also be accepting bitcoin?
brendaneich @jakethepanda please see reddit Question • BATProject We have answers, you may not be surprised by them: 1. Rate-limiting. Bots can fake human ad viewing (see, but we'll... @mward no, deeper integration than an extension (plugin still is overloaded for old-style stuff like Flash) can have
brendaneich @cannabanana ETH only, as BAT is an ERC20 token -- we are not launching a new exchange or anything, so other currencies have to be exchanged to buy BAT
boldninja When do you plan to start your initial token offer, will there be any hard cap?
jakethepanda @brendaneich Is this right? Users opt into the BAT system and get paid for their attention. Advertisers pay for ads with BAT. Through a smart contract, BAT is unlocked as users give the ad attention. The unlocked BAT is split up between users, Brave, and publishers.
brendaneich @mward we have BitGo provided bitcoin wallet integration in Brave already, ofc the wallet is on the blockchain not in Brave but the deeper integration is for the private, "chartbeats in your browser" auto-microdonation analytics, and the ZKP protocol over VPN to communicate your donations w/o loss of anonymity or fingerprinting via the list of your top sites
@jakethepanda that is the goal but doing it with real-time BAT flow is in the future, the "Apollo" (or Mars mission) space program phase; we're in "Mercury Redstone" rn, monkeys in buckets on parabolic paths
nt91 When is ico
brendaneich @boldninja @nt91 we haven't announced the date but will very (very) soon, just getting logistics and final audits done
@boldninja cap is $15M of ETH so we have to pin the ratio close to launch given recent vol.
dr10 How will you get Brave Browser to the masses? Any marketing campaign you like to sum up? Any bigger announcement or plan?
jakethepanda How is the split determined between users, publishers and Brave?
brendaneich @dr10 we are growing, mostly organically right now, under 1M MAU but we will (in best case of crowdsale) spend more to growth-hack, which is advertising + funnel analytics / retention analysis loop
tranzer @brendaneich don't know if you have been following tokencard ICO, but they had kind of a fuckup with their smart contract, also they didn't give their address of contract literally before it started. How will you go about this? Will smart contract, address be known beforehand?
brendaneich an important point: if we hit cap we will found a trade group for attention apps and get other apps on board to use BAT and help us get to scale faster with buy side of ad-tech system, also with bigger donor cohorts via membership in trade association
nt91 Once launched how quickly isit likely to join the exchange
brendaneich @tranzer we followed that closely, it was Not Good. we are using a super-simple contract based on FirstBlood, Golem, StandardToken
mward How will you make the crowdsale? Like Gnosis? (Dutch action) The BAT token wil have fixed price at the time of ico?
brendaneich @nt91 can't say, not our biz and we are building the "in game" economics first so exchanges can come any time
brendaneich @mward fixed ratio of BAT for ETH
fixcrypt @brendaneich will all the tx recorded on eth blockchain, or will you manage some sort of payment channels?
dr10 Do you plan to integrate decentralized VPN or Tor-Like stuff? Your browser is really fast, will these things slow it down? Or didnt plan any of this?
brendaneich @fixcrypt all on chain, no preselling, no funny stuff -- we believe in simplicity first, given all the experience in this space
mike would you be interested in using a different blockchain to eliminate all the overhead of paying such a huge network of computers on ethereum to each process every single contract on each computer? (edited)
cannabanana I hope you guys will reconsider accepting more than just eth for the ICO. I have not been able to invest in any of the past like 5 good ones. There's a whole segment of people who wont touch ETH.
tranzer @brendaneich ok I know this is not about BAT, but did you know that Ark is built in JavaScript :smile: ?
fixcrypt @brendaneich how many tx are we talking about? 1 each time there is a basic attention detected? (edited)
brendaneich @dr10 we are going to do Tor private tabs, see GitHub brave/browser-laptop browser-laptop - Brave browser for Desktop and Laptop computers running Windows, OSX, and Linux
we will make it possible to pick a region for exit node from Tor relay network -- so you can unlock region-locked videos, e.g.
yes, Tor slows things down and Tor private tabs turn on fingerprinting protection, turn off most JS, etc. -- that's a good thing
michaelthecryptoguy Very Nice!!
brendaneich @mike i'm a pragmatist and will use whatever blockchain is big enough, robust enough, has functionality we need (smart contracts, ZKP anonymity coming along, etc.). Zcash adding token support this fall, i hear. we don't multiply risk by jumping on bandwagons whose wheels are still off :wink:. we do not try 10 hard things at once -- space program from monkey in can to moon
@cannabanana we are launching an ERC20 token on Ethereum, you buy with ETH, we are not an exchange
the few launches whose contracts hardcoded a bitcoin address were launching exchange-like projects, so could take the risk
we are not doing that
separate concerns
@tranzer i heard :wink:
twitchard What do you think the adoption function for BAT looks like. Do you think there's a critical mass at which adoption will drastically speed up? Or do you think it is more gradual
brendaneich @fixcrypt no, in early phases of BAT program we cannot put each attention event on chain
obv. the chain is too costly, also: not anonymous! big tracking prob
fixcrypt agree
brendaneich we build in hybrid fashion
Brave already has v2 ZKP integrated
requires centralized but open source accounting server
fixcrypt ah yes make sense
brendaneich we'd like someone else to run that (escrow, also could add exchange to fiat as publishers like being paid in fiat)
dr10 Can I visit websites, that block Users, that use addblock? Is there a way to work around this? Currently I use brave browser and some pages block me, because of using addblock. What is your solution to this or do you think these website will change their behaviour?
brendaneich if we can do server to client remote attestation (see we will npm secureworker Run JavaScript inside an Intel SGX enclave
jonathansampson @dr10 That's a bug; let us know which sites are detecting Brave as an ad-blocker, and we'll file Issues on GitHub. We're constantly making improvements in this space, and recalibrating as necessary :slightly_smiling_face:
brendaneich eventually it should all decentralize but that requires the blockchain (a blockchain; could be red-headed lovechild of Ethereum and Zcash lol) to do anonymity and microtransactions both very well
fixcrypt so payment are done on blockchain, but it basically validates on a daily basis a centralised payment channel between all stakeholders
mike like the chart on ad percentages of sites in the whitepaper. I've noticed for a long time the mainstream news sites are the worst to go to, a literal assault on the browser visiting them - have avoided going to them as a result, think you're on to something to mitigate this.
dr10 I visited a german boulevard magazine
brendaneich makes my eyes bleed
dr10 so normally this wouldnt be the case?
yeah its just an example lol
because I know they block addblock people
jonathansampson @dr10 I'll file an issue immediately!
brendaneich @dr10 we get around forbes, wired, latimes, many other anti-adblockers
michaelthecryptoguy Will these be done on a multi - channel?
brendaneich publishers who put up such user-hostile dialogs tend to lose alexa/comscore share
gotta catch up on the Qs
@fixcrypt next
tell me if i missed you
fixcrypt no pb
tranzer Haven't used Brave yet, might try after today, but is it same memory hungry as Chrome is?
twitchard :wave:
1nfinite concerning the ICO - will there only be one? meaning all 700m coins will be distributed through this initial $15m ICO (meaning $1 will net you about 46BAT)? sorry if I'm misunderstanding some of the info you've put out in asking this
dr10 What if I want to support Live-Streams (twitch) or youtube videos by watching their ad (which is not part of the brave system) Can I still turn off this mechanism?
brendaneich @fixcrypt yes, we buffer automicrodonations over 30 days of your uptime (varies by user; if you go on vacation those days don't count) and send Anonize ZKP votes (one per voting session, all over VPN) to our accounting server, along with the total bitcoin per 30 days you pledged. this goes into settlement wallet, the votes go into accounting db
we want to decentralize this as noted, just repeating in case anyone missed
fixcrypt decentralize this will be hard, maybe when segwit is enabled on bitcoin, but ETH, i have no idea (edited)
brendaneich @michaelthecryptoguy sorry, what did you mean by multi-channel?
jonathansampson @dr10 You can track the issue here: (Thank you again for reporting) (edited)
fixcrypt i think decentralizing everything is not always the best solution
brendaneich @tranzer we use less memory than chrome by virtue of ad and tracker blocking but we have some bugs to fix pre-1.0 (which i think will be in june) -- i use brave on all OSes, also use a bit of other browsers to keep up with joneses but i've cut back and tried to live in brave. on macOS i am still bugged by mem use (i'm a tab hoarder) and some lag bugs but we are on them -- will fix this month!
michaelthecryptoguy one blockchain ledger with multiple transactions, instead of being signed one at a time (edited)
brendaneich @1nfinite yes, selling 700M, floating 300M on side for user growth pool (100M), trade association, team, and future reserve
1nfinite thanks!
tranzer so 70% to ICO and 30% for team / user growth? Sounds reasonable (more than gnosis :joy: )
moobox this is great to talk to brave devs - pls to make websites look like this: (173kB)
brendaneich @fixcrypt you could be right, centralization or let's say trusted third parties have existed since at least agriculture (10K years?) so we as pragmatists must consider some -- but we don't like "trust me" / "don't be evil", we prefer "trust Math" / "can't be evil"
michaelthecryptoguy then the last transaction is added to the blockchain
dafty what failsafes are planned to stop bots (eg, running selenium) from mocking a real human and gaining bat tokens? how do you know a user is actually a user?
jonathansampson @moobox We will support themes in a future release, as well as extensions to modify page presentation. If you have any favorites, please let us know :slightly_smiling_face:
moobox thank you sir
michaelthecryptoguy to improve the cost of using eth network
dr10 There are lot of small companies, Twitch/Youtube content creators which live by ads. These ads aren't yet part of the Brave-System. Will there be a smooth transition? Can I still turn off the brave-mechanism and watch these ordinairy ads, to support individuals or are they forced to switch over to Brave?
fixcrypt @brendaneich trust the code that can be hacked, or trust the people that can be evil… Make your choice. DAO vs Banks
brendaneich @michaelthecryptoguy yes, we must batch -- at first in-browser. auditable open source required, verified builds if OS/toolchain support them. there is a level of endpoint software trust in any attention ecosystem but part of the trade association idea is to standardize stuff, including ZKP and VPN rules for submitting the private ledger to the blockchain or equivalent, also auditing requirements to use BAT
cannabanana I trust bitcoin but I don't trust bitmain is not evil
brendaneich @moobox are you just asking for a dark theme? on our roadmap
moobox well this is a plugin for firefox that swaps out all website colors - nothing like it for chrome yet except an ugllly one
brendaneich @tranzer yeah, GNO didn't sell enough IMHO but i'm not on team so won't throw stones -- just sayin' as observer
mward Why only 15M$ max? Don't you think the ico will end very fast?
moobox i am just hoping maybe some person sees it and says "i want that too"
tranzer @brendaneich are you still active in JavaScript development? Could there be any kind of cooperation with Ark in the future (also asking main dev of Ark @fixcrypt ) ?
brendaneich @dafty did you see the reddit link above? besides real (costs money, boots on ground; we're evaluating Blockscore rn) KYC, we have rate limits in mind based on humans, and flow limits so a compromised real user or convincing fraudster can't get $MMs of BATs from friends and family and then pass KYC to send off to a mixer
cannabanana :trollbounce: not to mention two of us are in the bay area
brendaneich start with in-game economics, no exchanges
1nfinite any chance you'll incorporate certain requirements for investments above xx number of Eth for the crowdsale? to prevent 20 big players from buying up the whole thing?
axente How are you guys legally setup? Swiss foundation?
jonathansampson @moobox We have heard similar requests from other users, and are eagerly working towards a release that supports both theming of the browser, and styling of the content. Let us know if you have any other ideas/requests :slightly_smiling_face:
brendaneich add KYC on publishers getting donations (done in prototype form in Brave using bitcoin rn)
add KYC for users wanting to withdraw -- this also means rate/flow controls
fixcrypt @tranzer well the only point would be to use ark as the payment network, instead of ETH, i don’t see any other interaction. Also maybe make brave agnostic enough so people can choose their network payment
brendaneich but for many users the opt-in zero-knowledge ad revenue is not enough to withdraw and they'll donate it
you can net-zero your monthly spend: make ad rev on non-top-20 sites, donate to top 20
I should add we want to start with user-private ad channels, like WeChat
we won't put ads on publishers's slots without their consent and partnership
some will come fast but bigs will be slow
so we're looking for user private ads: in separate tab, wechat-like bot, fullscreen channel, etc.
these can pay most rev share to user
still rate limited, no couch potato as a service lol
dr10 what about the twitch/youtube question? How could this work out?
brendaneich @dr10 we've always had a design that denotes payee with URL including path to youtube/twitch account, not just domain name
but we start with domain name for beta/MVP
will get team on twitch/youtube in coming months, it's hot topic
everyone wants it, we're just busy (24 people now)
crowdsale will help
can hire more to parallelize a bit
dr10 so you are working on a solution to pay off individuals within the brave-system, right?
@ yt / twitch
brendaneich @mward we debated cap on and consensus was to keep at $15M -- but a few still suggest raising or no cap, much concern about fast sell-out and whales buying too much
mward yes, that is my concern.
look at gnosis distribution..
brendaneich @tranzer yes, i'm on Ecma TC39 and still active / consulted
mward you need a lot of small investors, not whales
dr10 When you implement Tor-like stuff. Can I also Download stuff via ToVpn? just using the Tor-Tab to download
brendaneich @1nfinite we aren't going to change the contracts, in third audit currently. we can't really limit whales who have tools to buy from lots of addresses
@axente we are not swiss but looking at tax optimization structures pre-launch; brave is delaware (US) c corp; trade group would be 501c6, need to pass IRS muster so that is many months after launch
axente Oke thanks
1nfinite got it, thanks. So will there be a cap for how much can be donated per address?
brendaneich @fixcrypt code is hacked, security never done; no silver bullets. but people are easier to hack and hack themselves lol
dr10 Is the brave browser running in a sandbox like chrome?
dafty how are inappropriate ads handled on the network, is there some form of reputation system for advertisers?
brendaneich @mward GNO sold too little, cetaceans eat too much agreed. GNT sold more and we can't find on-chain huge buys
@dr10 use Tor private tab, yeah
jonathansampson @dr10 That is correct.
brendaneich btw does everyone know Brave supports magnet: and .torrent now via WebTorrent integration?
@dr10 yes, we use chromium with the same sandbox -- had to fork electron hard (twice) to do this, btw. Slack uses unsandboxed chromium renderer processes :disappointed:
tranzer I think I'm sold on brave today will definately try it out
jonathansampson @tranzer Awesome. Let us know if you have any feedback!
brendaneich @dafty we haven't taken any ads at all yet so start from clean slate. no exchanges, ads bearing malware get thru, also fraud on sell side steals revenue by putting real ads into fake slots clicked by fake users Methbot | White Ops Digital Advertising Security. Enterprise Security Solutions. Bots are bad for business; we're bad for bots. (4kB)
our plan is to go direct to agencies who get ads from brands
our ads are opt in
no surprises for our users who want and expect baseline Brave to block
djselery @brendaneich what are your feelings about IPFS?
dr10 Will the Paying/receiving of tokens in the brave system be easy to understand for non-tech people? Is there some kind of tutorial or easy buttons or something like that? This is a total new environment for people. You have any plans for "educating" people or making it easy to use. Like a browser-integrated Balance? Easy overviews?
brendaneich if you opt in, you can start with light touch but to get BAT out you must KYC
@dr10 have you used Brave Payments (beta) yet? the support is built in
usable UX
tranzer will you need to do KYC also if you transfer to Brave and after that decide to put it out on exchange?
brendaneich we are moving (with new name, not "Payments") to second beta with Stripe as partner for users to fund automicrodonation wallet without seeing bitcoin
dr10 I have it installed and browse with it, but it is not taking me by the hand. I wouldnt know whats going it. I will look deeper into it.
brendaneich @djselery juan DMed me and we chatted about their JS implementation following WebTorrent into Brave -- it could happen. couldn't take the Go impl :wink:
@tranzer if you buy BATs as investor, no KYC -- just send ETH to token contract once launched, get BAT back
dr10 Maybe implementing something like a tutorial when starting brave browser would be nice. I am thinking of people who dont know any of this stuff and are not interested into researching it a whole lot
alexius89 @brendaneich are there partnerships with any exchanges (Bittrex, Bitshares etc.) planned or already confirmed after the crowdfund has ended?
geezee @brendaneich you should accept ARK :smile: :smile:
brendaneich @tranzer if you are a user of Brave after we launch BAT and have it integrated, and want to opt into ads, no KYC at first but the funds (to which you will have multisig custody, similar to bitcoin setup with BitGo wallet today in Brave for donations) flow in API-keyed and browser-automated fashion toward the accounting server that settles donations behind the anonize barrier
@tranzer if you want to send BATs from your wallet to other destinations then KYC needed
@dr10 go to Preferences / Payments; the Coinbase buy widget integration is US-only and a bit much for average users, wherefore our Stripe partnership
if you have BTC already, you can just fund your wallet and start
we have pinning (Patreon in the browser) in 0.15.2 now
so you can support sites with x% of your monthly budget whether you browse there or not
dr10 Will I earn more then I pay, when I chose to accept to watch these ads?
brendaneich @dr10 you don't have to pay at all, you can just earn
both donations (currently and in future) and ads (still to come, after BAT launch) are opt-in and separate
dr10 so basically what you say... the average dude can earn money just by browsing? It will be of couse small amounts, but better then nothing
fixcrypt @brendaneich on a business model side, is Brave team earning directly from this (ie part of the revenue redirected to the team for further development)?
tranzer Will bat have finitive coins and nothing added after few years or is there some subsection where you can increase token numbers via smart contract in the future ?
brendaneich @fixcrypt we are selling 70% and 30% floats on side. 10% is user growth pool. remaining 20% is reserves for team, (shorthand for; also have, and poss. user growth reserve
dr10 what if nobody choses to donate to pay money to the ad-publishers/BAT. doesnt the concept break down? I mean many people just want to earn. They watch these ads and get money.
brendaneich @fixcrypt biz model for Brave is not fundraising, though -- that's mostly burned down as non-recurring engineering, marketing (ads and growth hacking), etc.
biz model is small percentage (currently 5%) of automicrodonation gross, and larger (maybe 15%) off gross ad spend
these will be public numbers, we want transparency
if we do user-private ads, 85% of rev could go to user
part of Brave's brand is a set of promises: your data only on your devices in clear; we don't track, or store cleartext; rev share to you for opt-in ads at least as our share.
fixcrypt @brendaneich i see some maintenance with regular upgrades from chrome and advertisers relationship, so it needs a regular funding from transations i agree.
brendaneich @dr10 if everyone free-rides then system collapses; note this is risk today on Web, without Brave (which is small-share browser)
on Web today you can use a strong ad blocker like Brave, or
fixcrypt also will the revenue from donations will be contractual on the blockchain?
cannabanana do you have a contingency plan in case of critical ETH failure in the future?
brendaneich @tranzer contract is super-simple, we are making 1e9 BATs, no plans for more. can subdivide, expect appreciation but then use mostly as medium of exchange and unit of account, not store of value. don't want everyone hoarding. as with real world economies if everyone saved the system would collapse
michaelthecryptoguy for example the double spend issue like bitcoin had
dr10 What are your arguments for people donating for ads/keeping the money circulated. Why shouldn't they just cash-out their money?
Can you tell me an example of how much I would earn by browsing an hour? What is it depending on? Is there a good example to tell to people?
tranzer How are you going to counter exchange BAT price fluctuations? We all know tokens are highly volatile can go up 200% in a day or fall 50% in a day. How will you determine how much is someone paid ? Will you use USD value at time of contract with publisher / advertiser?
cannabanana @brendaneich wouldn't it be better to have a better distribution of BAT tokens during the ICO? currently in our environment with ICOs which have been selling out instantly is that there are like 10 whale ETH investors who get all the coins and hoard leaving out like 99.5% of the people who would have invested. (edited)
dr10 Dont know if I missed it. How much BAT will I get for 1 ETH?
fixcrypt @tranzer agree volatility is something advertisers don’t like (edited)
brendaneich @fixcrypt good q about transactional on blockchain, we do it all on bitcoin blockchain currently. we want transparency
have i mentioned ad tech is full of non-transparency, price gouging, etc.?
see Digiday ‘A proverbial black box’: Open-exchange auctions have a transparency problem - Digiday Demand-side platforms are unclear about how supply-side platforms charge their publisher partners, and they can't tell if a bid price is inflated. (199kB) Yesterday at 6:00 AM
@dr10 we haven't pinned the ratio and won't till close to launch date in view of ETH volatility
we are raising $15M equiv
dr10 tranzers question is good
like to know that too
brendaneich @cannabanana global war, giant meteor impact, etc. -- "exiguous circumstances" -- leave us with no good alternative, i mean this in deep civilizational sense. BAT launch will be least of our concerns. Short of these, the risk to Ethereum is low. could have primal flaw in design exposed. would have to rebase on another blockchain -- would be hard, tons of risk
catching up...
cannabanana do you guys even believe in blockchain?
tranzer Rebase to Ark :trollbounce:
cannabanana ok, nm.
brendaneich @tranzer can't volatility hedge yet (gamma hedge) as far as i know -- anyone know diff?
@cannabanana i believe in blockchain -- as with standards, the great thing about blockchains is there are so many :stuck_out_tongue:
@cannabanana we see no whalesign in GNT; if you mean GNO, see above. they sold too little
cannabanana well I also believe but not in ETH so you are basically only allowing ETH believers to partake in your project
michaelthecryptoguy Wow!! You are doing great @ brendaneich :goodjob: In the dedication and effort department! ::ghostfaceuk_node: (edited)
mward @cannabanana you can simply exchange btc to eth for ico. After ico ends and you have tokens, sell them for profit :trollbounce:
cannabanana and many projects recently "sold out" within minutes by 2m equivalent single transactions
@mward I wont ever buy any eth ever
brendaneich @cannabanana we are not religious about it, as noted above: tokens on Ethereum are proven tech (still young, mistakes and latent bugs, risk for sure but less than alternative token/smart-contract platforms). we are using Ethereum for smart contract based tokens and that's it
cannabanana that's not the point
you still must believe in it if you are only accepting eth
brendaneich @cannabanana did you actually check "many projects" to prove whalesign? we looked at some and aside from GNO couldn't find it
cannabanana :slightly_smiling_face: g/l
brendaneich @cannabanana we believe stuff, yes; have to believe to get up in morning, do anything
cannabanana i've been following altcoins since 2013
yes, i've seen them sell out in minutes
brendaneich but we are not Ethereum true believers in some zealot sense
cannabanana then why not accept bitcoin for the ICO
because of hte risk you said.
brendaneich i will say ETH price rise is scary; but EEA (JP Morgan -- federal reserve founder!) backing Ethereum is huge
mike i had a very bad experience with HEAT using Ethereum, still have to pursue it to track it down - time consuming so have put it off. Used an online wallet, jaxx, i think, since installing and waiting days for blockchain was a lot more than i wanted to deal with. Maybe there are better alternatives now.
cannabanana sorry man, didnt mean to hijack your ama
brendaneich @cannabanana accept bitcoin how?
hardcode a bitcoin address in the token contract?
Zooko's XCAT scheme?
it's cool but no thanks
K.I.S.S. rules
we will not multiply risk (odds ratios) of independent events
that's a good way to die
cannabanana wow you are a jerkoff man
I just wanted to invest in your project
but wont touch eth
brendaneich i was at a startup before Netscape (MicroUnity), talked to Jim Clark when I got to Netscape. said "we were doing ten hard things at once that all had to work for success" and Clark said "odds were 1e-10!"
cannabanana good god, good for you man
1nfinite way to be respectful @cannabanana - just because of some feud you have with ETH, too
brendaneich @cannabanana i'm not the one calling names here
techbytes let's not digress... stay on topic please
brendaneich i do like XCAT, check it out. cross chain atomic transactions
1nfinite thanks for the transparency here and taking the time to answer our questions @brendaneich
brendaneich np
i think i'm over time
did i miss anyone's q?
dr10 dr10 What are your arguments for people donating for ads/keeping the money circulated. Why shouldn't they just cash-out their money?
Can you tell me an example of how much I would earn by browsing an hour? What is it depending on? Is there a good example to tell to people?
brendaneich @dr10 thanks
dr10 np :smile:
tranzer Thanks brendan for answering all of my questions - good luck with the project I'll be sure to participate
brendaneich if people see ads and cash out, the ad business is working and perhaps it dominates
moobox thank you for answering my questions also
brendaneich today's web relies mostly on ads, few paywalls and they convert poorly
i have a feeling with automatic, anonymous microdonations and payments we will see more of that and less reliance on ads
but cannot count ads out, for sure
mike any chance of eliminating the KYC so people can just withdraw their BAT and trade it?
brendaneich @dr10 comScore had a figure of 100 page views per user per day
devin Bitcoin is to slow
mike i don't see where kyc adds any value for the users.
tranzer @mike you won't need KYC if you are just going to trade as far as I got this (edited)
brendaneich assume we partner on one ad per page (just for easy math; i don't like this model and think user-private ad channel with one ad per day might be much better)
100 ad impressions per day, 3000/month, if $3CPM that is $9/month
twitchard Is there some way/what do you think would be the best way for developers interested in advancing your mission to contribute?
brendaneich if we put the ads in user private channel and share 85% to user, that is $7.65/month to user
$3CPM is low figure
dr10 CPM means?
mike like the idea very much over all.
noslawxtrafries cost per impression I believe
brendaneich it's an ad cost model: Cost Per Mille (Mille from Latin for 1000 impressions)
video ads pay more; not just CPM but CPX for X = watch a video by quartiles; watch to end; click on download promotion after end (usually game ad)
mike so KYC is just to withdraw to fiat, but to withdraw to an exchange or another wallet is unrestricted?
brendaneich @devin yes, bitcoin too slow; no privacy either (edited)
devin Screw bitcoin
I want a project that accepts both
brendaneich @mike KYC is required or fraud kills the system faster than regulators (who will kill it too) (edited)
@devin there are projects doing this but they are "upstream" of ours
dr10 What are your 3 major arguments for mass adoption of Brave Browser. - Some Slogan you would give to magazines, etc.
brendaneich Fast (3-7x, see next link), Private, and you get paid for your attention
but remember we want the 501c6 trade association if we sell out. BAT is for multiple apps
mike have you looked at Blockstack for ID as an alternative to KYC?
brendaneich more than Brave
@mike yes (I know founders and saw them recently); that doesn't help
dr10 yeah but Brave will be the flagship of BAT token, right? Or any other big vision planned? (edited)
brendaneich @dr10 Brave will be first, yes
eventually everything here should be a standard
nothing's proprietary
twitchard Could BAT be implemented as a plugin/extension to other browsers? (Would it be more practical to fork?) (edited)
dr10 good question
mike or is KYC just needed for a threshold to withdraw above. it does seem there would be a pratical limit of how much organic ad traffic a user would be exposed to.
brendaneich blockchain, ZKP, even functional specs for KYC, definitely payments -- all should be standards used by lots of apps and services and people
@mike please find "rate" and "flow" above
ryano Dpos is probably the best consensus approach for things like this
devin @brendaneich thanks
brendaneich @twitchard BAT in extension is unclear as extensions have limited APIs, and often must be loaded from a store that has rules
kik got thrown out of iOS app store for doing its own payments some years back
CWS kicked out Ad Nauseum
mike i can see where someting is needed to mitigate clickfarms in low wage regions.
brendaneich i'm half hour overtime so have to go soon
@mike yes, and sybil attacks to route funds to a mule
stuff like that
ryano Thanks for your time Brendan
twitchard Thank you
brendaneich np, it was fun (except for the jerkoff thing :-/)
tranzer Thanks good luck
dr10 thank you very much
ryano Let me guess canna ?
cannabanana lol
man I asked a legit question and got shit on
so fuck it
jakethepanda Hi everyone. As Brendan mentioned, he will be wrapping up the AMA. @brendaneich Thank you for your time.
1nfinite thanks @brendaneich , learned a lot just from the terminology you've been using. Will spend time looking into all this, but your project sounds great
ryano Still dude, it's not good if you are predictably the one causing trouble
brendaneich @dr10 here's the "Fast" money shot
cannabanana well some people can't all be agreeable
brendaneich uploaded this image: Pasted image at 2017-05-09, 10:33 AM Add Comment
ryano You are the only one where this is an ongoing issue
It's bad for our community
cannabanana no, it's not. it's good because I give a different perspective on things. I'm not like you and I don't agree.
you think the success of ark has been on the backs of all the "good" ones?
brendaneich @cannabanana us taking ETH and me giving the reasons why we won't multiply risk is not me shitting on you -- we will have to just miss out on you this time. i wish we could take multiple currencies but it's an exchange problem at this point. maybe XCATs help in future
cannabanana I asked a legit question about what if it fails. what about hte investors?
is that not a legit question?
cannabanana if you want me to put money in, I want to put in something I believe in
not something I dont
mike yes, if they want to stick with ETH, it's their call. Obviously plenty of ICOs have been successful with it, so it will continue in the future.
cannabanana consumers too, it's the same thing if it fails then the system is gone then the peopel who bought the bat to use are all out too.
brendaneich @cannabanana that's ( fair and it means in a market, sometimes you don't make a deal -- you hold out for better product later (edited)
calling names and getting mad because someone won't do what you demand -- not fair. my 2 cents anyway
ryano You can't be calling guests jerk offs and trolls every time they don't tell you what you want. This is an ongoing issue with you. Nobody else here is lashing out at people except you and there are nearly 2000 people here.
jamiec79 oh lordy...
jamie exits the room quietly
cannabanana you know what nm
techbytes @brendaneich appreciate you stopping by today. Will put AMA on Reddit for others to find out more about your project.
brendaneich @techbytes thanks for having me
ryano Thanks Brendan
nt91 Brendan thank you for coming
ominous.shark Yeah, thanks for the AMA! @brendaneich ARK community appreciates it!
mike thanks for taking the time to talk with us about BAT, good luck with it.
michaelthecryptoguy :goodjob: Brendan and :goodluck: with the BAT ICO (edited)
boldninja Thanks @brendaneich - good luck with BAT
brendaneich thanks again
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What is Bitcoin? A Step-By-Step Guide For Beginners An in-depth guide by BlockGeeks

An in-depth guide by BlockGeeks
Content available at:
If you want to know what is Bitcoin, how you can get it and how it can help you, without floundering into technical details, this guide is for you. It will explain how the system works, how you can use it for your profit, which scams to avoid. It will also direct you to resources that will help you store and use your first pieces of digital currency.
What is Bitcoin in a nutshell Small wonder that Bitcoin emerged in 2008 just after Occupy Wall Street accused big banks of misusing borrowers’ money, duping clients, rigging the system, and charging boggling fees. Bitcoin pioneers wanted to put the seller in charge, eliminate the middleman, cancel interest fees, and make transactions transparent, to hack corruption and cut fees. They created a decentralized system, where you could control your funds and know what was going on.
Bitcoin has come far in a relatively short time. All over the world, companies, from REEDS Jewelers, a large jewelry chain in the US, to a private hospital in Warsaw, Poland, accept its currency. Billion dollar businesses such as Dell, Expedia, PayPal, and Microsoft do, too. Websites promote it, publications such as Bitcoin Magazine publish its news, forums discuss cryptocurrency and trade its coins. It has its application programming interface (API), price index, and exchange rate.
Problems include thieves hacking accounts, high volatility, and transaction delays. On the other hand, people in third world countries may find Bitcoin their most reliable channel yet for giving or receiving money.
What is Bitcoin in-depth? At its simplest, Bitcoin is either virtual currency or reference to the technology. You can make transactions by check, wiring, or cash. You can also use Bitcoin (or BTC), where you refer the purchaser to your signature, which is a long line of security code encrypted with 16 distinct symbols. The purchaser decodes the code with his smartphone to get your cryptocurrency. Put another way; cryptocurrency is an exchange of digital information that allows you to buy or sell goods and services.The transaction gains its security and trust by running on a peer-to-peer computer network that is similar to Skype, or BitTorrent, a file-sharing system.
Bitcoin Transactional properties:
1.) Irreversible: After confirmation, a transaction can‘t be reversed. By nobody. And nobody means nobody. Not you, not your bank, not the president of the United States, not Satoshi, not your miner. Nobody. If you send money, you send it. Period. No one can help you, if you sent your funds to a scammer or if a hacker stole them from your computer. There is no safety net.
2.) Pseudonymous: Neither transactions or accounts are connected to real world identities. You receive Bitcoins on so-called addresses, which are randomly seeming chains of around 30 characters. While it is usually possible to analyze the transaction flow, it is not necessarily possible to connect the real world identity of users with those addresses.
3.) Fast and global: Transaction is propagated nearly instantly in the network and are confirmed in a couple of minutes. Since they happen in a global network of computers they are completely indifferent of your physical location. It doesn‘t matter if I send Bitcoin to my neighbour or to someone on the other side of the world.
4.) Secure: Bitcoin funds are locked in a public key cryptography system. Only the owner of the private key can send cryptocurrency. Strong cryptography and the magic of big numbers makes it impossible to break this scheme. A Bitcoin address is more secure than Fort Knox.
5.) Permissionless: You don‘t have to ask anybody to use cryptocurrency. It‘s just a software that everybody can download for free. After you installed it, you can receive and send Bitcoins or other cryptocurrencies. No one can prevent you. There is no gatekeeper.
Judd Bagley: What is BlockchainThe creator of bitcoin figured out a way to let two entities confidently trade directly with one another, without the need to rely on all these intermediaries. The key is mathematics. As long as we both trust in math, we can be confident the exchange to occur as expected.
Bitcoin uses public key cryptography and an innovative approach to bookkeeping to achieve the authorization, balance verification, prohibition on double spending, delivery of assets and record inalterability described above. And it happens in near real time at no cost.
Cryptography ensures authorization. You need a private key to transact. And your key is complex enough that it would take the best computer longer than the earth has existed to crack it. In other words, it’s essentially unhackable.
– Director of Communications at and Chief Evangelist at
Where can I find Bitcoins? First, we would recommend you read this in-depth guide for buying Bitcoin.
You can get your first bitcoins from any of these four places.
A cryptocurrency exchange where you can exchange ‘regular’ coins for bitcoins, or for satoshis, which are like the BTC-type of cents. Resources: Coinbase and LocalBitcoins in the US & Canada, and BitBargain UK and Bittylicious in the UK. A Bitcoin ATM (or cryptocurrency exchange) where you can change bitcoins or cash for another cryptocurrency. Resources: Your best bets are BTER and CoinCorner A classified service where you can find a seller who will help you trade bitcoins for cash. Resources: The definitive site is LocalBitcoins. You could sell a product or service for bitcoins. Resources: Sites like Purse. Caution! Bitcoin is notorious for scams, so before using any service look for reviews from previous customers or post your questions on the Bitcoin forum.
How does Bitcoin work? Without getting into the technical details, Bitcoin works on a vast public ledger, also called a blockchain, where all confirmed transactions are included as so-called ‘blocks.’ As each block enters the system, it is broadcast to the peer-to-peer computer network of users for validation. In this way, all users are aware of each transaction, which prevents stealing and double-spending, where someone spends the same currency twice. The process also helps blockchain users trust the system.
“Unlike traditional currencies, which are issued by central banks, Bitcoin has no central monetary authority. Instead it is underpinned by a peer-to-peer computer network made up of its users’ machines, akin to the networks that underpin BitTorrent, a file-sharing system, and Skype, an audio, video and chat service. Bitcoins are mathematically generated as the computers in this network execute difficult number-crunching tasks, a procedure known as Bitcoin “mining”. The mathematics of the Bitcoin system were set up so that it becomes progressively more difficult to “mine” Bitcoins over time, and the total number that can ever be mined is limited to around 21 million. There is therefore no way for a central bank to issue a flood of new Bitcoins and devalue those already in circulation.”
What is Bitcoin? A Step-By-Step Guide For BeginnersSave How can I store my bitcoins? To see how the system works, imagine someone called Alice who’s trying out Bitcoins. She’d sign up for a cryptocurrency wallet to put her bitcoins in.
The Bitcoin Wallets
There are three different applications that Alice could use.
Full client – This is like a standalone email server that handles all aspects of the process without relying on third-party servers. Alice would control her whole transaction from beginning to end by herself. Understandably, this is not for beginners. Lightweight client – This is a standalone email client that connects to a mail server for access to a mailbox. It would store Alice’s bitcoins, but it needs a third-party-owned server to access the network and make the transaction. Web client – This is the opposite of “full client” and resembles webmail in that it totally relies on a third-party server. The third party replaces Alice and operates her entire transaction. You’ll find wallets that come in five main types: Desktop, mobile, web, paper and hardware. Each of these has its advantages and disadvantages.
How do I buy and sell stuff with Bitcoins? Here’s the funny thing with Bitcoins: there are no physical traces of them as of dollars. All you have are only records of transactions between different addresses, with balances that increase and decrease in their records that are stored on the blockchain.
To see how the process works, let’s return to Alice.
Example of a Bitcoin transaction
Alice wants to use her Bitcoin to buy pizza from Bob. She’d send him her private “key,” a private sequence of letters and numbers, which contains her source transaction of the coins, amount, and Bob’s digital wallet address. That “address” would be another, this time, the public sequence of letters and numbers. Bob scans the “key” with his smartphone to decode it. At the same time, Alice’s transaction is broadcast to all the other network participants (called “nodes”) on her ledger, and, approximately, ten minutes later, is confirmed, through a process of certain technical and business rules called “mining.” This “mining” process gives Bob a score to know whether or not to proceed with Alice’s transaction.
The transaction between Alice and Bob
What is Mining? Mining, or processing, keep the Bitcoin process secure by chronologically adding new transactions (or blocks) to the chain and keeping them in the queue. Blocks are chopped off as each transaction is finalized, codes decoded, and bitcoins passed or exchanged.
Miners can also generate new bitcoins by using special software to solve cryptographic problems. This provides a smart way to issue the currency and also provides an incentive for people to mine.
The reward is agreed-upon by everyone in the network but is generally 12.5 bitcoins as well as the fees paid by users sending transactions. To prevent inflation and to keep the system manageable, there can be no more than a fixed total number of 21 million bitcoins (or BTCs) in circulation by the year 2040, so the “puzzle” gets increasingly harder to solve.
What do I need to know to protect my Bitcoins? Here are four pieces of advice that will help your bitcoins go further.
As you’d do with a regular wallet, only store small amounts of bitcoins on your computer, mobile, or server for everyday uses, and keep the remaining part of your funds in a safer environment.
Backup your wallet on a regular basis and encrypt your wallet or smartphone with a strong password to protect it from thieves (although, unfortunately, not against keylogging hardware or software). Store some of your bitcoins in an offline wallet disconnected from your network for added security. Think of this as a bank, while you, generally, keep only some of your money in your wallet. Update your software. For added protection, use Bitcoins’ multi-signature feature that allows a transaction to require multiple independent approvals to be spent.
Spending some time on these steps can save your money.
We recommend the Nano Ledger S – Hardware Wallet
Nano Ledger S is just as secure as the other two hardware wallets. It is popular because of its relatively low price of $65 compared to its competitors. Being smaller than KeepKey, it is more portable and easier to carry around. It is a hardware wallet that comes at a very competitive price.
What else do I need to know? Protect your address: Although your user identity behind your address remains anonymous, Bitcoin is the most public form of transaction with anyone on the network seeing your balances and log of transactions. This is one reason why you should change Bitcoin addresses with each transaction and safeguard your address. You can also use multiple wallets for different purposes so that your balance and transaction history remain private from those who send you money.
Your confirmation score: As said, you receive a confirmation score of about 10 minutes before you make your purchase. Different wallets have their own reading.
Government taxes and regulations: Government and local municipalities require you to pay income, sales, payroll, and capital gains taxes on anything that is valuable – and that includes bitcoins. The legal status of Bitcoin varies from country to country, with some still banning its use. Regulations also vary with each state. In fact, as of 2016, New York state is the only state with a bitcoin rule, commonly referred to as a BitLicense.As shown in the Table above, zero is the least with the number 3 being the most reliable for average bitcoin transfers. If you’re sending or paying for, something valuable, wait until you, at least, receive a 6.
What are the disadvantages of Bitcoin? Bitcoin got off on the wrong foot by claiming an apocryphal person (or persons), Satoshi Nakamoto as its founder. Nakamoto has never been found.
Regarding more practical concerns, hacking and scams are the norms. They happen at least once a week and are getting more sophisticated. Bitcoin’s software complexity and the volatility of its currency dissuade many people from using it, while its transactions are frustratingly slow. You’ll have to wait at least ten minutes for your network to approve the transaction. Recently, some Reddit users reported waiting more than one hour for their transactions to be confirmed.
Scams to watch out for
The four most typical Bitcoin scams are Ponzi schemes, mining scams, scam wallets and fraudulent exchanges.
Ponzi Scams: Ponzi scams, or high-yield investment programs, hook you with higher interest than the prevailing market rate (e.g. 1-2% interest per day) while redirecting your money to the thief’s wallet. They also tend to duck and emerge under different names in order to protect themselves. Keep away from companies that give you Bitcoin addresses for incoming payments rather than the common payment processors such as BitPay or Coinbase. Bitcoin Mining Scams: These companies will offer to mine outrageous amounts of bitcoin for you. You’ll have to pay them. That’s the last you’ll see of your money (with no bitcoins to show for it, either). Bitcoin Exchange Scams: Bitcoin Exchange Scams offer features that the typical bitcoin wallets don’t offer, such as PayPal/Credit Card processing, or better exchange rates. Needless to say, these scams leave you in the hang while they siphon your dollars. Bitcoin Wallet Scams: Bitcoin scam wallets are similar to online wallets – with a difference. They’ll ask you for your money. If robbers like the amount, that’s the last you’ll see of your deposit. The address, in other words, leads to them, rather than to you. Of all of these, wallet scams are the most popular with scammers managing to pinch millions.
What are the advantages of Bitcoin? The best thing about Bitcoin is that it is decentralized, which means that you can settle international deals without messing around with exchange rates and extra charges. Bitcoin is free from government interference and manipulation, so there’s no Federal Reserve System‍ to hike interest rates. It is also transparent, so you know what is happening with your money. You can start accepting bitcoins instantly, without investing money and energy into details, such as setting up a merchant account or buying credit card processing hardware. Bitcoins cannot be forged, nor can your client demand a refund.
It’s small wonder that users call Bitcoin “Money 2.0” or that Bill Gates called it “a techno tour de force
An in-depth guide by BlockGeeks
Content available at:
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Disney blackmailed over apparent movie hack: reports

This is an automatic summary, original reduced by 51%.
Movie website Deadline identified "Pirates of the Caribbean: Dead Men Tell No Tales," which opens on May 26, as the target, without revealing its sources, while some film writers speculated on Twitter that Pixar's "Cars 3," due for release next month, might have been hit.
The cyber-thieves demanded to be paid in online currency Bitcoin and are threatening to release five minutes of the movie, followed by 20-minute segments until the ransom is delivered.
"Dead Men Tell No Tales" is the fifth in the "Pirates of the Caribbean" series, which stars Johnny Depp and has taken $3.7 billion at the box office since 2003.
Sci-fi novelist Paul Tassi, who comments on technology and the internet for Forbes Magazine, said "Pirates" would be unlikely to suffer were it the target, since its release date is so near.
"Yes, going to a movie in theaters is one of the more exhausting media experiences still left in society, but the kinds of people who are willing to pay money to see Johnny Depp stumble his way through a fifth 'Pirates of the Caribbean' movie in theaters are probably not the type to download a stolen copy of it right before it comes out," he said.
"And like all movies, 'Pirates' would appear on torrent sites regardless practically the day of its release, so the hackers seem to be really over-estimating their impact here."
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Thoughts on Bitcloud and redesigning Internet in general.

First of all I'd like to apologize if I understood Bitcloud incorrectly, I am not an engineer, just someone who reads a lot of computer magazines and follows that stuff. From what I get it's Freenet meets Maidsafe meets Bitcoin, bluntly put. Much of this turns into a rant about how the Web could be improved rather than Bitcloud discussion, but I would like to hear from you if this is lunacy or could actually be done.
In order to create a new internet the central infrastructure should probably be a peer to peer social network, e-mail, search engine, cloud storage, file sharing and cryptocurrency (anything Google and Facebook do really). All of these have individually been done to some extent (YaCy, *Diaspora, BitTorrent Sync, MaidSafe and probably more), and I already mentioned Freenet, which allows you access in return for giving up a part of your hard drive and hosting some of the data. I assume Bitcloud allows you to do the same except you determine how big a part of the hard drive you give up and you earn Cloudcoins based on your upload rate, choosing which percentage to share with the content owners. Since many ISP's offer low upload rates, how will this impact Cloudcoin generation?
Another interesting question is will spending the coins when viewing/downloading content be automated(you view someone's music video and their host gets the appropriate amount of coins from you and then shares with author according to arrangement. Kind of like torrents, except most people leech and delete the torrent immediately, and there is no monetary incentive to do otherwise. An incentive system sounds awesome, but with upload rates as they are the ratio of download to upload being 1 to 1 seems impossible. That said, a system that automatically rewards content providers based on popularity would be a nice alternative to copyright.
For the Bitcloud to take flight both passive users and content producers would have to be attracted. For the passive user the prospect of making money just by renting out hard drive space is the big hit. In addition to UI being great and all the services working like expected, the ability to move without hassle from Facebook to the new social network or from Gmail to whatever the name for e-mail service will be, contacts and everything, would help attract users.
Additionally, passive web users are not just consumers but are producing a ton of data by their every action, which helps search engines categorize data which is used by advertisers. Compensation for both this data (if the user decides to make it available publicly) and watching advertisements (someone purchasing your time to persuade you to buy their product) could perhaps be built into the system as well somehow.
Content producers would be attracted by receiving coins for their content being viewed/downloaded, plus add revenue and prices they set themselves. With in-built advertisement system, similar to Google adsense, the producehost could then even share part of the profit with the viewer. The producer could also set the percentage of income that someone can earn by sharing the link (that is when and if that link is clicked on and viewed).
Bitcoin has had so many ups and downs in values, which could be avoided with cloudcoins in that most people would be viewing them from the start in a kind of gamified experience of web surfing (getting "points" for sharing and hosting content)instead as something to be gathered and get rid off for "real money" when time is right. Kind of like dogecoin but with useful application.
Bitcloud replacing the current net and eventually becoming a meshnet going around ISPs flared up a megalomaniac in me, so accepting the estimate Eric Schmidt gave that there's about 5 billion gigabytes online, getting 500 million people to store 10GBs each would do it. This isn't how I think it will go, just a kinda feasability check. Considering Bitcoin is 256 times faster than top 500 supercomputers according to a Forbes article, Bitcloud becoming the worlds largest cloud storage service, enabling it to swallow the current web data and any data the future will need stored is not that far fetched.
Megalomania continuing, why not add distributed cloud computation if it is possible, perhaps as a separate currency within the same system. I've read how hard this is when people discussed merging BOINC and Bitcoin, but it doesn't seem impossible. CPUsage is developing a commercial distributed computing platform, though they haven't been doing that well, hard to balance demand and supply it seems. Another project to pay attention to would be High Fidelity, a new virtual world Philip Rosedale (Second Life) is working on. His words are: "We're building a coordination system enabling millions of people to contribute their devices and share them to simulate the virtual world.", and they are going to be offered some sort of virtual money like Linden Dollars. Simulating a world would involve both storage and processing of data, but it sounds way too advanced to be possible. Bitcloud running apps, games, doing its own encryption work, search engine webcrawling and becoming a market for computation in general would be epic.
Back to earth, designing something like this will require genius. But if Linux and Wikipedia could get done collaboratively online why not Bitcloud, and there is always crowdfunding once the vision becomes clearer. Not only that but there are so many similar projects online it might not be necessary to start from scratch, and many of those working on other peer-to-peer projects may be persuaded to help.
Bitcoin benefited a lot from libertarians and tech culture in general promoting it, but political approach in promotion may alienate some programmers with skill from helping, especially if they are doing p2p research as part of government projects. The irony is that secure and decentralized Internet, while it sounds like an anarchist project, would benefit governments (and banks come to think of it) greatly. Major deterrent to digitization in government is that data centers would be vulnerable to both internal corruption/incompetence as well as DDoS attacks. A secure distributed cloud storage solves these issues, and if there aren't any other security issues it could even be used for online voting.
The ultimate project would be replacing every aspect of society, government and economics with functional Distributed Autonomous Corporations, and how that works out partially depends on these early experiments. Ending on that note, good luck to people working on Bitcloud.
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